You want to grab a seat early when Carol Reese comes to town for a talk. She can a throw an entertaining stemwinder soaked with humor. The woman’s got soul and conviction.
The former horticultural extension specialist in Jackson, Tennessee, came to Louisville ten days ago as the keynote speaker for the Winter Conference of the Kentucky Nursery and Landscape Association (KNLA). Carol drew a crowd. No wonder. She’s a pro who doesn’t shy away from admitting countless failures in life or in the garden. She tells the truth that a lot of gardeners don’t want to hear. She was saddled with lingering effects of winter hoarseness that made her sound like a north Mississippi version of Lauren Bacall. All the more fetching.
Her talk title: “They Don’t Know What They Don’t Know.”
Carol Reese grew up on a dairy farm near Starkville, Mississippi, in a family with six brothers and sisters. She both read as voraciously as she played outdoors. Her dad was an engineer and successful businessman. And Carol told Nursery Management Magazine that she thought “everyone’s mother could paint, sculpt and fix tractors.” Carol entered horticulture in her mid-30s, after one failed attempt at college and marriage and a protracted ten-year run of “wasting as many brain cells as a girl could and still be able to walk upright.” Her family had Carol’s back. They never gave up. She gave up the bar stool and returned eventually to her childhood passion for gardening. Carol received a Master’s Degree in Horticulture at Mississippi State University, and then she lost crucial data for her dissertation when a doctorate almost seemed a cinch. She went to work for the University of Tennessee where, for 27 years, she answered thousands of questions across the horticultural spectrum. Along the way, Carol became a popular national speaker and columnist for the Jackson Sun.
Here are a few highlights, and impressions, from her KNLA talk and subsequent phone talks and follow-up emails.
“They don’t know what they don’t know.”
“Even the students that realize they need to know more to be successful think it’s as simple as what to plant here. This could be likened to a recipe of ingredients without knowing how to cook. When I was teaching the Master Gardener classes on design, I told them early on, I would NOT be talking about any specific plants at all. The woody class and the herbaceous class that followed would address regionally adapted specifics for a variety of design functions. I really liked when I could teach all three, often the case for the counties in my region. It was very disappointing when I would be approached after class with a picture of a garage wall, and the query, “What would you plant here?” My disappointment was deliberately displayed with a sigh, that I had failed to teach them how to decide on their own, with the tools I hoped I had provided!”
“We want the perfect shrub forever and ever.”
Carol acknowledged that homeowners often don’t know what questions to ask. Fear creeps in when simple questions are answered with too many caveats.
I had a flashback when I heard this at Carol’s talk. I have spent nearly 50 years trying to answer questions from anxious homeowners about the risk of planting—anything. I would offer: “If it doesn’t get to hot or too cold, too wet or too dry, you’ve got a window of opportunity.” This answer never seemed satisfactory enough. One time, in frustration, I responded by saying, “Your plant will live if it’s God’s will.” This sparked a surprised look, and then a nod with a response, “Well, I guess you’re right.”
“Come on over for lunch and tell me what to plant.”
Doctors don’t give free advice, neither do lawyers, but professional gardeners are sometimes taken for granted.
“Even for those who did not pay for years of academia, the years of accumulation of hard-earned knowledge, often expensively won by killing costly plants, or costly travel to see successful gardens and listen to experienced gardeners and designers, warrant respect and financial reward,” Carol explained. “I laugh sometimes, that the only people that I would gladly help for free, close friends or family, DON’T consult me, to my dismay.”
“We want native plants because they are better.”
Not exactly…
Carol told the audience that the push for exclusively native plants in home gardens is “dangerous and ill informed.” She grows lots of native plants and absolutely loves being in nature, but she’s not shy about telling audiences, for example, that northern sea oats (Chasmanthium latifolium) and cup plant (Silphium perfoliatum) will take over your garden if they are left to re-seed. She acknowledges that there are sites where these might be suitable, but not in mixed perennial plantings. Again, it’s the little things that the purists ignore and the fallacies they push. How can anyone with an open mind imagine a wild roadside of clover, chicory, and Queen’s Anne’s Lace as ecologically offensive? Don’t get Carol going on pollinators. Go ahead and plant a few non-natives on the purist’s hit list—buddleias, mimosas, or paulownias. They germinate out of cracks in a sidewalk. They have indisputable ecological and restorative benefits. “You won’t be the first to go rogue. Birds and creatures have been transporting seeds and plants for millenia. Carol said, “Mother Nature is in charge. The only constant in planetary time is change.”
The Lucifer list
There is a line in the sand. Carol would never recommend planting these plants in west Tennessee:
English Ivy
Wintercreeper (Euonymus fortunei)
Liriope spicata
Vinca minor
What plants would you throw in your sin bin?
Success and failure
“What makes someone fearless and another fearful? It takes both for our species to exist. In ancient times, those that ventured far from camp may have gotten lost or eaten a poisonous plant in hungry ignorance. Some, though, found a new source of a recognized food, or tried a new one that was not toxic, but nourishing. Maybe lives were lost trying to kill mastodons until discovering it could be done with a group that planned the attack. The timid people may have died in the name of safety by not daring to try something new. Some of the bold died, but others not only survived but learned new ways to prosper. I don’t mean to brag, because I certainly made no choice to do these things, just part of my brain that dictated it. I think true courage is acting in spite of fear. I had none. Would I be the one killed by the mastodon?”
“Fearlessness can punish or reward. My usual lack of fear is based on the amount of certainty that I will survive embarrassment, but mostly on my confidence that the exchange will be rewarding. My siblings joke about our “daddy’s genes” that inform our daily interactions with others. He was a deeply good man, with a knack for making others laugh, and making them feel seen and appreciated. Maybe he wasn’t as good with tools or paintbrushes as my mother, but give the man a telephone, and watch him charm his way through a network of contacts to get to the person that could make things happen. They may have answered the call in a less than helpful mood, with no idea of how good they were about to feel for helping him on his mission. One of the greatest lessons he taught us might be that we should expect good things of people when we treat them well.”
“How do we teach?”
“Our reach is cramped, crowded out by product driven Internet garbage. If I don’t even understand how algorithms or clickbait work, how am I supposed to fight them? We can only do what we do in small circles that radiate into larger ones. We can write but how do the ignorant know we even exist if they don’t know we exist, another case of they don’t know what they don’t know. At the dentist today, the sweet young woman cleaning my teeth made innocuous statements about gardening she had read somewhere, wrongheaded, product driven information that had me nearly frantic for her to take her hands out of my mouth so I could refute it. The third time it happened at least I had the presence to apologize for correcting her again and again.”
“Some of my best teachers answered my questions by asking me questions. They led me logically to my own answer by asking me to acknowledge my own experiences. Others, like The late Plato Touliatos, beloved nurseryman from Memphis, had the gift of putting a huge amount of wisdom into a pithy line or two that rang true with common sense.
As Plato would have it, the lowest maintenance landscape for our region is a woodland landscape because the south wants to be woodland. Plow a field and watch it come back in 40 years.
Last, but not least, and possibly the best, though most out of reach method, is to integrate required schooling in critical thinking. Instill skepticism as a way of navigating the world. Teach the difference between print and journalism. Just because it’s in print doesn’t make it true. Along with skepticism comes developing a base of knowledge that instills trust in your own observations. If years on a farm, or in a garden, have revealed many cases of native lepidoptera eating nonnative plants, you know to investigate claims to the contrary.”
Carol Reese is seldom bored.
–Carol Reese, a Garden Ranter Emeritus, attributes her love of horticulture to being raised on a farm by a generation of plant nuts, including a grandfather who dynamited his garden spot each year to partially “break up his hard pan.” Carol’s very personal appreciation of natural lore is at least partially a result of her nearly daily rambles through the wild areas near her home with her motley collection of mutts, also known as the strong-willed breed of “Amalgamations.” Carol plans to put her 118 acres into a conservation easement that will allow the next owners to garden and landscape at will on a few acres around the house but will leave the rest of the property in perpetuity for the natural beauty that preceded her.
I’m guessing Carol wrote with serendipitous coincidence, “Some of my best teachers answered my questions by asking me questions.” The Socratic method.
Then, “As Plato would have it, the lowest maintenance landscape for our region is a woodland landscape….” (Alas no mention of hemlock….)
I garden in the oak sand and pine country of Southern New Hampshire, a wonderland of goldenrods and asters. Drive to any powerline cut throughs in September and you will be stunned at the sight. Yet when people tell you they want only native plants and you tell them about aster cordifolius or showy goldenrods or aster laevis they are adamant . “No”, they say”, “Those are weeds”. I hear this from local garden club members. In their brains exists the perfect mythical plant that butterflies can find instantly in the suburbs encased in concrete and 4 lane highways, that never spread or set seed, that never need watering, that flower all season. Oh, yes, that one can feel smug about planting. Last summer when I was working in the museum garden a lady stopped to look at the borders. ”
“But native plants are better than non natives aren’t they?”, she asked.
I had only one thing to say.
“No”.
I will let peonies and hostas and zinnias and hardy crysanthemums defend themselves.
So enjoyed your article. Some of us just take longer than others to mature. Looks like you did it and very well! Plato’s Mom named him well. Opa! My decades old geraniums keep surviving in my little greenhouse. Every year I say, This is it for you guys. I’m not digging you up and putting you in the greenhouse for winter again and then out and transplanting into pots for the summer.. But the plants refuse to die and in fact, thrive.. blooming all winter! And at age 76 I will again transplant them this year. We gardeners just keep digging, eh? Regards. Eowana in Virginia.
Allen,
Once again, one of your articles has made my day. I am at home recovering from a second bout with Covid (happy that I am of age to get Paxlovid with no questions asked). I have never had the opportunity to meet Carol Reese; and, have always wanted to meet her. Your summary of her presentation made me feel that I was listening to her in person! Thank you!
Jennifer Brennan
She is de-lightful! Must be because she’s from Tennessee! (grin, me too!)
Carol Reese is a truthteller and a voice of reason, How I wish one of the garden clubs up here would get her to come speak instead of some newly minted horticultural ideologue whose every other word is “pollinator”.
I have heard Carol speak and agree she is a gifted communicator and has a wealth of knowledge. Which is why I am even more dismayed by this statement (and I heard her say something similar before): “Don’t get Carol going on pollinators. Go ahead and plant a few non-natives on the purist’s hit list—buddleias, mimosas, or paulownias. They germinate out of cracks in a sidewalk. They have indisputable ecological and restorative benefits. “You won’t be the first to go rogue. Birds and creatures have been transporting seeds and plants for millenia. Carol said, “Mother Nature is in charge. The only constant in planetary time is change.”” She is displaying a very defensive ignorance of the very real science behind the problem of prolific non-native plants. No rogue bird brought over millions of buddleias, mimosas, paulownias, or whatever. Humans did this on a volume and time scale where native flora and fauna can’t adapt. I’m not a purist; I still have non-native plants on my property. But shame on Carol for belittling a very real problem.
Thank you! My thoughts exactly! Her recommendation of planting these 3 very invasive species is repugnant!
Buddleia have become a host plant and provide many benefits https://milliontrees.me/2017/10/06/butterfly-bush-an-example-of-the-escalating-war-on-non-native-plants/
Shortlived mimosa has become a valuable ally in rehabiliting soils ruined by strip mines etc. Free of charge! https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8734550/ Name one bad thing it does..
Ditto for paulownia https://paulowniatrees.org/documents/3/2016-February-AmericanPaulowniaAssocNewsletter.pdf
Just because you see these where we scar and disturb the earth, doesn’t make them “bad”. Mother nature is trying to use them to heal from our gashes of the earth and you are telling her she doesn’t know what she is doing. Each plant (to the unprejudiced) must be measured by the good it does as well as the detrimental. Native plants can also do great harm Juniperus viriginiana is considered a terrible invasive in some parts of the country. Please add context of today’s times and realize how fast insects adapt to opportunity. Perhaps you might peruse the new sciences of studying novel ecosystems as nature’s best hope for surviving today’s uber developed and stressful environments. Start here with an open mind. I am on the side nature! Chew, M. & Hamilton, A. “The rise and fall of biotic nativeness: A historical perspective,” in Fifty Years of Invasion Ecology: The Legacy of Charles Elton, ed. D. Richardson (Blackwell, 2011) 36-47. and in Davis, M. et al. Don’t judge species on their origins. Nature 474, 153-154 (2011).
Allen,
Bice article! Thank you!
In gentle defense of doctors and lawyers who may be perceived to be not as generous as gardeners, I suggest that many times the questions presented at curbside consultations raise many potential issues or factors in medicine or law which are not easily or quickly dsspensed with . . . much the same when an experienced gardener is asked: “What’s the best plant for me?’
The difference is that garden question answered without proper consideration will not result in death or grievious harm. That’s not the case in medicine or law. So, often enough, an answer of “Come and see me about this” is an appropriate response, (even it sounds like the motivation is earning a fee).
Regards,
John
Very gently put. Thank you. I think the more important message is to not lean quite so much on the professional garden people in our midst even though they are really generous about answering questions. As a Master Gardener, I’m supposed to know how to do my own research but I know I get lazy and ask my friend the expert too often instead!
I’m just your basic ignoramus, one who plants anything she can find that will grow and survive deer and hot summers. “Everyone” goes on and on about natives, and I always wonder, “Native to where?? Everything is native to someplace!” So, I continue to plant whatever I can, probably making mistakes with 90% of what I do.
Bravo!
Well, if you google “what is a native plant,” the most common definition is: “A plant is considered native if it has occurred naturally in a particular region, ecosystem, or habitat without human introduction.” https://www.nwf.org/Garden-for-wildlife/about/native-plants You don’t say where you are, but I bet there is a native plant society that would be happy to help you learn what’s native to your area. Deer are a problem everywhere, but there are plenty of native plants that survive deer browse. Good luck!
Thank you, Sharon. I’ve never actually looked for the definition. Maybe I don’t really want natives, because if I did, I’d plant nothing and let it all happen naturally. Nope. I need daffodils, iris, flowering quince, flowering pear and Chinese pistache trees, and all sorts of spirea. And rosemary, lavender, something called “Texas Ranger”, and with germander, which is just glowing brilliantly now in my yard (the foothills of Central California).
I’m not sure I’d get natives at all if I just let my yard go natural — there is such a reserve of invasives out there now. I’ll just keep trying to keep a balance of some actual very site specific natives and the garden plants I love while rooting out the invasives when I spot them in my little patch.
I am so sorry I didn‘t know she was in town! She is one of most favorite speakers. Besides making me laugh, I agree with her vision
Wow, really spoke to me after so many years in the plant world! So eloquent! I love JC Raulson’s pic!
This is a wonderful rant. Thank you for reminding us why we garden in the first place. I have been gardening for 20 plus yrs, reading all tje books recommended, and now that I no longer have a plot in which to plant (of course I plant in pots!) I spend time every day enjoying the many old trees and the birds and the deer that come through the neighborhood. There’s much life to enjoy!
My sweet takeaway from this article – “It will live if God wills it”. I’m stealing it. A great answer for the same questions I get from friends and neighbors.
Carol Reese’s statement that “the push for exclusively native plants in home gardens is “dangerous and ill informed” is dangerous and ill informed. As in all gardening, specific plants must be chosen to fit their intended place and function. One can just as easily (and more accurately) say “the push for exclusively Asian plants (or hybrid plants, or selections) in home gardens is dangerous and ill informed.” Our gardens are 80% alien plants, and this is damaging the ecosystem by depriving insects (aka bird food) of their necessary food plants. Traditional gardeners, and much of the profession, are so intellectually and emotionally invested in their boxwoods, azaleas, cherry laurels, hostas, daylilies…. that they are completely blind to the harm they are causing to the food web. Reminds me of Marie Antoinette response when told the people were starving (“they have no bread”): “Let them eat cake.”
Thank you Jacquelyn, for the great rejoinder.
Who is pushing for Asian plants? I am pushing for plants that provide the most benefits, no matter the origin. My major concern is the food web, and those that wish to restrict our choices to only natives in today’s extremely stressful times. Novel ecosystems may save us, but closed minds certainly won’t. I love how you assume this about me…”intellectually and emotionally invested in boxwoods, azaleas, cherry laurels, hostas, daylilies…. that they are completely blind to the harm they are causing. I assure you that my motive is to use all plants that help the food web. Personal attack is part of what I must endure to fight on. Maybe you could investigate another view, starting with Chew, M. & Hamilton, A. “The rise and fall of biotic nativeness: A historical perspective,” in Fifty Years of Invasion Ecology: The Legacy of Charles Elton, ed. D. Richardson (Blackwell, 2011) 36-47. and Davis, M. et al. Don’t judge species on their origins. Nature 474, 153-154 (2011).
So, first we bring over alien plants that wreck the ecosystem (along with many of our other foolish acts), then we use these same plants to ‘create’ a new ecosystem that will ‘save’ the ecosystem? I don’t think so. We should spend time and money removing invasive alien plants from our natural areas. We, as home gardeners (and park managers and designers of commercial/industrial/civic landscapes) should replace our alien plants with the most beneficial keystone native species, to restore our ecosystem. We don’t need to be 100% native, but we need to tip the 80/20 ratio to 20/80. I’m doing this in my little 1/2 acre yard, while keeping my beloved peonies, camellias, and cleematis).
“We” are not using nonnative plants to recreate beneficial ecosystems. Nature is. I hoped a reading of the articles referenced in my replies above could have offered fascinating evidence of nature’s resilience, articles written by people much smarter than I, articles written by people who began their careers with the belief native was the way to go, people who changed their minds as they watched how quickly our native fauna adapted to the offerings nature plainly demonstrates are willing to thrive in our scarred , stripped, hot and poisoned environment. Might you ponder any hypocrisy as your fork ferries “alien” food to your mouth, that we are saying good nutrition from other parts of the world are great for us but not for them? “They” (our fauna) are telling you it’s good stuff. Observations of all true gardeners demonstrate this truth (surely you grow fennel for black swallowtails? One of many beneficial nonnatives…even bermudagrass, a common turfgrass of the southeast, is now the preferred host for the fiery skipper, a specialist insect, and provides bountifully for armyworms, a generalist insect, and boy, do the birds love them! Native lepidoptera and countless other insects etc. benefit from plants that supply their necessary nutrition, origins are of no consequence to them. Remember who the big winner is from “removing invasive alien plants”. It’s the big chemical companies, and yes, professors who have built careers, funding and followers from trying to prove “aliens are bad”. In their efforts to do so, nonnatives have been shown to sometimes be preferred over natives, as in this research done by Doug Tallamy and others. If you peruse it closely you will see that caterpillars (even specialists) sometimes preferred nonnnative plants over native, lacebark elm over American elm, European birch over our native river birch and European linden over American linden. You might think that adding lacebark elm would be good idea then, since the vast majority of our American elms have succumbed to fatal vascular diseases, i the point is to provide for caterpillars, right? That would put our insects and wildlife first, instead of native dogma first. Sadly, that was not the case. I hope you will continue to explore the opportunities offered by nonnatives to sustain our ecosystems in today’s overpopulated times. At least I hope you will believe that you and I share the same goals, and are open to the ideas that many plants can help us with these goals and should be chosen on those merits rather than on their origins.